Thread: Gender definition

Observation: Put on a bathrobe - females fold the right side over the left and males fold the left side over the right. Could this be used as a gender definition, irrespective of sexual interest?

No.

Why not?

Are you serious?! No is the only sensible answer to a daft question...

Same applies to polo shirts (buttons) as bathrobes.

Gender definition?
Do gay people have a mix of XX and XY chromosomes?
Someone was trying to convince me, but I thought it was all to do with genes.

Are you ever born into the wrong body?

duplicated, sorry.

The question may be trivial, but there are important questions - public toilets, professional sports. These need to addressed apart from sexual interests.

And you think they can be addressed by reference to how someone wears a bathrobe? Laughably silly.

Bathrobe folding is a taught skill NOT a biologically innate aspect of gender.

And yes people are born into the wrong body, it's called being transgender and not addressing it can lead to gender dyspepsia, depression, and suicide.

Mathman, have you been listening to fearmongering about "the gayz" again?

Originally Posted by Paleoichneum

Bathrobe folding is a taught skill NOT a biologically innate aspect of gender.

And yes people are born into the wrong body, it's called being transgender and not addressing it can lead to gender dyspepsia, depression, and suicide.

Mathman, have you been listening to fearmongering about "the gayz" again?

My post has nothing to do with sexual interest, but rather the public problem of transgender. Which public bathroom? More important, particularly for a woman with a male body, is athletics. Which basketball team? Track and field has rules - fair? My original post has to with boys and girls, learning to dress themselves, would learn according to physical bodies.

Its only a problem in a society where trans people are demonized and equated to rapists and pedophiles.....

People learn things by trial and error, so your opening post is ignorant of reality. If they are a trans woman they play on the womans team if they are a trans man they play on the men's team. (I will point out now that there is NEVER any fauxoutrage over transmen playing on means teams, take a monet to really think on that)

Originally Posted by Paleoichneum

And yes people are born into the wrong body,

Explain how.

How basic do I need to make it for you?

E.g. have you done any actual reading on Transexual, gender, orientation topics, or do you still hold to "Drs are infallible and a brief check of the genital area after birth is the epitome of a person's gender/orientation"

No matter how basic you make it some people are still pig ignorant...

I will accept any hard science about this, but it appears there isn't any.

https://unherd.com/2022/05/you-cant-...he-wrong-body/

And you feel that a conservative news site/blog https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/UnHerd is an acceptable source for that assertion over actual medical professionals why?

Given the article you linked to it seems you are already working from a notable science deficit/transphobic information viewpoint.

Originally Posted by Paleoichneum

Bathrobe folding is a taught skill NOT a biologically innate aspect of gender.

And yes people are born into the wrong body, it's called being transgender and not addressing it can lead to gender dyspepsia, depression, and suicide.

Mathman, have you been listening to fearmongering about "the gayz" again?

Gender dyspepsia, i.e. indigestion? Is that a thing? Or do you mean gender dysphoria? That's a term I have heard.

Originally Posted by Paleoichneum

And you feel that a conservative news site/blog https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/UnHerd is an acceptable source for that assertion over actual medical professionals why?

Given the article you linked to it seems you are already working from a notable science deficit/transphobic information viewpoint.

Then you explain gender.
Men from Mars. Women from Venus. This debate has been going on for 30 years.
Is it genetic? Is it psychological? A bit of both? Or what?
Let's hear your definition.

Again I will ask why you feel that your news article trumps medical professionals, as your leading question indicates you feel the medical professionals that study this are less informed then a conservative journalist with no medical training at all

Well lets start by disabusing the notion that external body
morphology is relevant at all to the concept of gender....

Men are from mars yadda, yadda, yadda is a 60s pop psychology meme that has no relevance to the self identification of an individual with either or both ends of the gender spectrum. There is a full continuity between "male" and "female" within the human species with external and internal expressions varying with each person..
It is not a he or she only situation.

A persons brain and body chemistry are what form that persons expression and identification as a gender. ( Its not if they have a cock or boobs).

My original question was simply about public use - toilets, locker rooms (pools and gyms), sports. etc.

Gender neutral restrooms have been the standard in MANY countries for decades with no issues. So again why are you worrying?

Why in your mind "DO" they need to be addressed, if as you purport, sexual attraction is NOT part of the rational being cited? If sex is out its seems to be entirely a strawman argument that anything need to be addressed at all

Originally Posted by mathman

The question may be trivial, but there are important questions - public toilets, professional sports. These need to addressed apart from sexual interests.

Indeed, the only option left in re definitions for men and women that make any sense to straight folks is how they answer nature's call (number 1) - women sit, men stand.

Originally Posted by Agent Smith

Originally Posted by mathman

The question may be trivial, but there are important questions - public toilets, professional sports. These need to addressed apart from sexual interests.

Indeed, the only option left in re definitions for men and women that make any sense to straight folks is how they answer nature's call (number 1) - women sit, men stand.

Well except that ignores the full spectrum of intersex folks transsexual folks and everybody else who also has morphologically external Plumbing but do not identify that way. Trying to tell lgbtq plus people who they are when you are a straight person is rather rude

Originally Posted by Paleoichneum

Originally Posted by Agent Smith

Originally Posted by mathman

The question may be trivial, but there are important questions - public toilets, professional sports. These need to addressed apart from sexual interests.

Indeed, the only option left in re definitions for men and women that make any sense to straight folks is how they answer nature's call (number 1) - women sit, men stand.

Well except that ignores the full spectrum of intersex folks transsexual folks and everybody else who also has morphologically external Plumbing but do not identify that way. Trying to tell lgbtq plus people who they are when you are a straight person is rather rude

For a person with a man's body but identifies as a woman, which basketball team? Track and Field has tests.

Originally Posted by mathman

Originally Posted by Paleoichneum

Originally Posted by Agent Smith

Originally Posted by mathman

The question may be trivial, but there are important questions - public toilets, professional sports. These need to addressed apart from sexual interests.

Indeed, the only option left in re definitions for men and women that make any sense to straight folks is how they answer nature's call (number 1) - women sit, men stand.

Well except that ignores the full spectrum of intersex folks transsexual folks and everybody else who also has morphologically external Plumbing but do not identify that way. Trying to tell lgbtq plus people who they are when you are a straight person is rather rude

For a person with a man's body but identifies as a woman, which basketball team? Track and Field has tests.

For a person that identifies as a woman that is their choice, and policy (bias or un) will dictate if they are able to participate.

As AWAYS though I note the only hypothetical is that of a trans woman in sports, never that of a trans man in sports. The obvious bias shows in the question.

Originally Posted by Paleoichneum

Originally Posted by mathman

Originally Posted by Paleoichneum

Originally Posted by Agent Smith

Originally Posted by mathman

The question may be trivial, but there are important questions - public toilets, professional sports. These need to addressed apart from sexual interests.

Indeed, the only option left in re definitions for men and women that make any sense to straight folks is how they answer nature's call (number 1) - women sit, men stand.

Well except that ignores the full spectrum of intersex folks transsexual folks and everybody else who also has morphologically external Plumbing but do not identify that way. Trying to tell lgbtq plus people who they are when you are a straight person is rather rude

For a person with a man's body but identifies as a woman, which basketball team? Track and Field has tests.

For a person that identifies as a woman that is their choice, and policy (bias or un) will dictate if they are able to participate.

As AWAYS though I note the only hypothetical is that of a trans woman in sports, never that of a trans man in sports. The obvious bias shows in the question.

There is no bias - only a recognition of physical reality. If someone with a woman body wants to compete in men sports - good luck. Athletic contests separate men and women because men are bigger and stronger. Also men run and swim faster.

Ahhh, the faux outrage is strong this morning. So you actively admit it ONLY matters if its a transwoman that is in question, and actually has nothing to do with the bathroom as you originally purported it did. If someone is transitioning, that means they are on a regimen of medications and hormone therapies that effect their physical status. Also the minute percentile of athletes that are trans is very notable, they are very few and far between (hence all the outrage from transphobic "news" sources reporting MASSIVE ABILITY INJUSTICES!!!!!)

Originally Posted by Paleoichneum

Ahhh, the faux outrage is strong this morning. So you actively admit it ONLY matters if its a transwoman that is in question, and actually has nothing to do with the bathroom as you originally purported it did. If someone is transitioning, that means they are on a regimen of medications and hormone therapies that effect their physical status. Also the minute percentile of athletes that are trans is very notable, they are very few and far between (hence all the outrage from transphobic "news" sources reporting MASSIVE ABILITY INJUSTICES!!!!!)

Transwoman are always the target of rightwing outrage. Whether it be about sports of bathrooms. Because lets face it they still see transmen as being women, and thus posing no threat in athleticism or in sharing a bathroom with them. But they will see a transwoman as a man until she's had every bit of "masculinity" removed, ie as long as they get tits and a pussy they're able to truly be counted as women.

It's disgusting and as you've rightly pointed out numerous times, that view fails to account for numerous individuals who do not conform to the narrow margins that they present. I mean how do you account for people born with female external organs, but have testes inside them instead of ovaries? Which is just one of dozens of intersex combinations that are possible at birth. Then there's people born with two penises or two vaginas, are they considered doubly male or doubly female to the right wingers? They operate from such a science ignorant standing in regards to this whole area that it's damn near laughable.

Originally Posted by Paleoichneum

Ahhh, the faux outrage is strong this morning. So you actively admit it ONLY matters if its a transwoman that is in question, and actually has nothing to do with the bathroom as you originally purported it did. If someone is transitioning, that means they are on a regimen of medications and hormone therapies that effect their physical status. Also the minute percentile of athletes that are trans is very notable, they are very few and far between (hence all the outrage from transphobic "news" sources reporting MASSIVE ABILITY INJUSTICES!!!!!)

How about gym and p.t. classes in school? Physical body type will dictate which class to go to, irrespective of sexual interest.

So again it all boils down to "does that person have a cock". how very 1950's