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Thread: Our Secular System in Crisis

  1. #1 Our Secular System in Crisis 
    Forum Bachelors Degree charles brough's Avatar
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    We have, in the modern world, a common secular belief system which has brought some unity to a very divided humanity. This belief system consists primarily in the belief in constitutional government which we term “democracy.” It also includes the concept of “free will,” the “free enterprise” economic system, indivudalism, rights, equality, etc. Included in it is the belief in the leadership of science. And finally, it is regarded as generally compatable with a liberal interpretation of the Christian Scriptures and, even with a loose, liberal interpreting of any and all of the old religions. This is what has made it able to unite the various religions of the world and the societies they bond. It bonds them all into a single
    global economy, United Nations, or “the world community of nations.”

    What is happening is that this secular system is in a process of collapse. This is bringing us a world that is very different from what it had been. It is a climactic event.

    In the 1990s, it seemed that the US leadership had brought human civilization to the point where the US model of “democracy” would lead to the “democratic unity of mankind.” That has not happened. Democracy has proven unable to spread any more. This has given the leadership of the US the option of spreading it through force of arms. In the last five years, that is what it has claimed it has meant to do.

    It overturned a brutally, stark Taliban regime in Afghanistan and a brutal, adventurous dictator in Iraq. But the “democracy” established in both places has failed miserably. Afganistan is now a opium growing war-lord-run country and Iraq is now in civil war.

    This means that not only is democracy viewed as not spreading in the world but not even able to take hold when “liberated” (or iwhen democracy is mposed). And with the whole secular belief system being not so gradually denigrated by what is happening but actually put into a state of decline, people feel the only alternative is to return to the beliefs of their fathers. It is called religious reaction.

    Few people realize how fast this collapse of the civilizaed world's secular system is proceeding. We are now binging aboug an increasingly old-religion-led scattering of nations in hostile competition with each other for the natural resources the world's too-rapid population growth is causing.

    Each of these mainstream religions---Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Asian Marxism---intend to replace the others and in that way bring unity to the human race, but it will never happen. They are all too old or defective (or both) to lead people to converge into one or the other.

    The only long term solution to this growing crisis is the eventual replacing of our secular system with a more effective one. In other words, the must urgent need is not the immediate eradication of any or all of the world's old religions but of the re-building of the secular world system with a new world view and way of thinking capable of bringing mankind together again---one that focusses on such things as the conquest and colonizing of the universe, being anti-racist, mindful of the enviornment, promoting family planning, free trade, etc.

    Charles, http://humanpurpose.simplenet.com (hits now numbering 455 per day!)


    Brough,
    civilization-overview (dot) com

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    Charles,

    You seem to have posted this twice, I deleted the original copy on the grounds that the second may have contained corrections [although a brief scan revealed none. I presume you just hit the button twice in error [or panic] - I would have PM'd you but I see you have an outstanding PM from me regarding a previous moderator action - which remains unread.
    I must ask that at least occasionally you check for private messages [just click on 'you have x new private messages' at the top right on any screen.

    THanx,

    Mega.


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  4. #3  
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    That's a pretty interesting post Charles. I hope you're wrong about a secular belief system on the decline, but I do agree with your conclusion at the very least.
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  5. #4  
    Forum Bachelors Degree charles brough's Avatar
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    I dread coming up with a duplicate post. Thanks for erasing the first one!

    I suppose the Administration is now intent on first bombing Iran and then in "regime change." We will try to set up "democracy" there also.

    That failure will drive even more Westerners to Christianity and Muslims to their Mullhas.

    charles
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    IMO, I don't think the world is all that much different than in the past. After all, there was a 1000 yr war between Islam and Christianity. And in the past century, we saw democracy vs fascism and then "democracy" vs communism. except that the US hardly acted in a democratic way in dealing with other countries during this period. (E.g., assassinating elected leaders of other countries if we thought we couldn't do business with them.)

    The resurgence of Islam in the last few decades can be viewed, at least partially, as the result of a forced westernization in the Middle East. (Islam, and particularly Shia, views the west as corrupt and materialistic.)

    Another part of this is that a lot of people worldwide don't think of us as the good guys, given our past history. They think we're hypocritical about democracy.

    A new world view would be nice, but I think it's incumbent on you to suggest one. One that can replace the capitalism-as-religion ideology of the US Establishment.
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  7. #6  
    Forum Bachelors Degree charles brough's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IBrakeForTrees
    IMO,
    A new world view would be nice, but I think it's incumbent on you to suggest one. One that can replace the capitalism-as-religion ideology of the US Establishment.
    It would have to appear as what is called "a new paradigm" in that every part of it would be contradicted by secular or religious doctrines and ways of thinking. Otherwise, it would not be new.

    It would have to be based entirely on accurate science data---especially that of the social sciences as it would need to be applied social science.

    However, I have found that the social sciences are not objective and that social science theory is slanted to secular and religious beliefs---not openly or intentionally, but even so, they are because there is a subtle intent to avoid conflict and dissension. There is a subconscious effort to shape social theory in ways that do not offend religious and secular beliefs.

    What I have done is re-interpret social science theory from a totally atheistic perspective and without any compromise with "spirit" and "mircalce" beliefs and thinking. Even so, I have found that a new world-view and way of thinking would have to incorporate some principles and doctrines of the old faiths that "work" and the logical, provable reasons why.

    The same all applies to our secular beliefs. They were effective at one time. Much of it can be salvaged by some modifications. For example, democracy would no longer be an ideal, but constitutional government would be recognized as fundamental to government. Racism would give way to an ideal of the mixing of the races and the equality of opportunity would have to be established, also, equality before the law; however, there would be nothing about everyone being equal because they are not.

    In Ancient times, new religions evolved to appeal to the most people---which would include both the poor and the better educated who saw it as advanced over previous beliefs---as Christianity was, for example, over the polytheisms (and it, in turn, was advanced over animism).

    This new world view and way of thinking does not have time to evolve and should not need to. It just needs to be forumulated correctly now.

    So, how would that be done? What I do in my website, http://humanpurpose.simplenet.com is dig into the social sciences and come up with the evolutionary purpose and function of religion, analyze the nature of the questions all religions have to answer to serve that function, and then actually construct from all that an advanced belief system based solidly on the sciences, one which would serve to build a new society, a society capable of building a new civilization. If it is not the real thing, then at least it is a good facsimile of it.

    charles, http/humanpurpose.simplenet.com
    Brough,
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    Good luck with that.

    My own view of science is that it's more of a method than a particular body of knowledge. That is, scientific method looks at data, analyzes it, draws conclusions (theories), then pits those theories against new data, making predictions about the data if possible. It's an ongoing, iterative process -- meaning that your theories are always changing. Basically, you approach ultimate truth but never actually reach it.

    A couple of things I found very interesting are the Teaching Company course, Questions of Value (given by Prof Patrick Grimm). Also, the WK Clifford essay, the Ethics of Belief (1877) is one of the best essays I've read -- and is available for free online.
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    Oops! I thought for a moment this was "Our Solar system in crisis"...
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  10. #9  
    Forum Bachelors Degree charles brough's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IBrakeForTrees
    Good luck with that.

    My own view of science is that it's more of a method than a particular body of knowledge. That is, scientific method looks at data, analyzes it, draws conclusions (theories), then pits those theories against new data, making predictions about the data if possible. It's an ongoing, iterative process -- meaning that your theories are always changing. Basically, you approach ultimate truth but never actually reach it.
    .
    In other words, there is no such thing as "truth" to us. Our knowledge just grows more accurate with use of the scientific method.

    charles
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