Notices
Results 1 to 30 of 30
Like Tree16Likes
  • 1 Post By dan hunter
  • 1 Post By granpa
  • 1 Post By babe
  • 2 Post By cosmictraveler
  • 1 Post By Cogito Ergo Sum
  • 1 Post By jrmonroe
  • 4 Post By Dywyddyr
  • 3 Post By dan hunter
  • 2 Post By Chucknorium

Thread: Cravings

  1. #1 Cravings 
    Forum Junior
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    267
    Addictions are the result of cravings.
    Cravings are not the same as desires.
    Desires are normal and healthy.
    You desire things that are desirable.
    You can crave things that are not desirable.
    Cravings are unhealthy.
    You are drawn toward your desires but you are driven toward your cravings.
    One pushes and the other pulls.

    When you crave an addictive substance you feel an urge to have that substance.
    This urge that you feel is your body poking you with a sharp stick
    and refusing to stop until you have done what it wants.

    Afterwards your body punishes you for doing what it urged you to do.
    It shames you and makes you feel guilty (and does other things to you that I cant talk about on a PG rated forum)
    (The wages of sin is death)

    Your body is a psychopath.
    Your body is thinking only of itself
    You are its slave


    You HAVE a body. You HAVE an ego.
    You are not your body.
    You are not your ego.

    Your ego is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must rule over it.


    Reply With Quote  
     

  2.  
     

  3. #2  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope cosmictraveler's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Key West, Florida, Earth
    Posts
    4,788
    Reminds me of a old song....





    Steppenwolf - The Pusher - YouTube


    When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace.
    Jimi Hendrix
    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #3  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    38
    Granpa,

    That's a brilliant thing you said. It reminds of Swedenborg's work - The Secret's of Heaven - when he talks about the "deeper" interpretation of the Genesis as it pertains to the "self," not the mundane world as humans today have somehow interpreted it.

    On a side note, I have a hard time looking at any piece of literature and being told "It's the word of God! But... some of it's just 'poetry', and some it's actually true, as in it really happened in history and the Vatican is holding all of this top secret proof of it!" How does one to respond to that? My first question would be (if I had never seen the bible before), "Well, which parts are true?" But, having read the bible most all of it is fantastical; how can we say any of it is true? Why should the Vatican hold all of the evidence of Jesus's existence, and share it only with "special" people with a "special" status or mission? Why hasn't Jesus' slippers made it's visit to your local ancient history museum?!

    In my personal opinion, which may not account for much in the grander scheme of this entire mess, the bible is simply written using language that could be understood by laypeople of that era, by all people of that era, who were seeking to understand the "trials and tribulations" of simply having a "soul" that inhabits and lives as a human being on planet Earth, and were seeking to reconcile the dichotomy that exists between us and the seemingly "soulless" nature of other beasts. Realistically, I can only presume that "soul" must be akin to a consciousness - our consciousness or awareness - because today we can still observe a difference in magnitude between the consciousness of a Bonobo and our own consciousness.

    So, what does one do in response to the sharp stick? How does one master the psychopathic body?
    Last edited by ByAccident13_7; April 2nd, 2014 at 09:18 PM.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #4  
    Forum Junior
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    267
    the first thing is to recognize the difference between a legitimate desire and a craving.
    the second thing is to recognize that there is absolutely no point in even trying to please this slave driver.
    Any such efforts merely make things worse.
    nor is there any point in beating yourself up.
    It will not gain you any sympathy from the psychopath.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #5  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by granpa View Post
    the first thing is to recognize the difference between a legitimate desire and a craving.
    the second thing is to recognize that there is absolutely no point in even trying to please this slave driver.
    Any such efforts merely make things worse.
    nor is there any point in beating yourself up.
    It will not gain you any sympathy from the psychopath.
    Well, I agree with this "offensive-defense" method toward a craving that inhabits the psychopathic body (thus, creating an addiction). Do you mind we call our body's "beasts"? Because these bodies are creatures that live on this planet along side other beasts.

    Having said that: yes these bodies are beastly; yes they sure are selfish... but like all beasts on this planet they deserve be in the same love that we give to greater ideas, expansive thoughts, and innovations of which this consciousness within these beasts is capable (whether it's mechanical complexity or some actual inhabitant of our physical brain - I'm not going to make that conclusion for this discussion because I don't see that it's relevant)

    As humans, we go through great lengths to preserve the natural world in fear of losing it to the fate of our own mistakes. We know, clearly, that our existence relies directly on the existence of the natural world. But now we're at a point where, while training ourselves to rise above the beast, we are harming the beast physically or emotionally or psychologically (if the emotional evidence is not there). We see this in our ecosystems, too, while species of animals and plantlife go extinct due to climate change and pollution and littering. We see it in ourselves when people are addicted to drugs or food or hurting other people

    So what good does the consciousness of this beast serve if it only sees it as a beast? Something to neglect or discard and never speaks to it and calms it's violent nature?

    I see it that it is important to please these beasts. But please them with what? You and I may both agree that we CANNOT please them with whatever it is they desire or crave. These cravings are almost always harmful, and these desires are cyclic and do not bring satisfaction - they do not bring happiness.

    How then can we please the beasts in which consciousness exists, without catering to it's ​OWN addictive, violent, selfish nature?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #6  
    Forum Junior
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    267
    the Beast doesn't desire the things that it makes us crave.
    the Beast just desires to f*** with us
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #7  
    Forum Junior
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    267
    it's hard to wrap ones mind around the thoughts of a psychopath but, strange as it may seem, they don't want your love, your respect, or your understanding.
    They want you to mind your own business and that is exactly what you should do.

    and the only thing you can do
    Last edited by granpa; April 2nd, 2014 at 10:27 PM.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #8  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    38
    Well, I agree to a point. I cannot say that any animal on the planet wants to F___ with anything by it's own malicious nature. I can say that every animal has an instinct to survive, and this instinct generates an action that may harm others and may harm themselves (a rattlesnake biting it's meal or a coyote chewing it's leg off, respectively). But in both cases these actions are seeking to fulfill a basic need or instinct that is important for their survival. As humans, we are given more advanced hardware between our ears, and somehow that generates very complex abilities to analyze and interpret abstractions in our universe, or examine for irregularities in a system that WE create, or experience overwhelming and passionate sensations of love and bonding between mother and child or between a married couple. Simple things that we take for granted are actually pretty amazing occurrences when compare world, because somehow we are conscious of this - and more importantly we are conscious of it's ultimate cessation, though we choose to ignore it. Hence, the birth of evil.

    The fact that these beasts are complex enough to harbor a consciousness such as that which we are using to contemplate these ideas, should make them special and in need of our care, and should not be seen as creatures only "desiring to F__ with us." Because, then, we become the beast.



    Ultimately, we're talking about taming the beast that has an irrefutable need to survive somehow, while seeing a foreign advanced being as a threat (in this case, the consciousness the beast holds - because, let's face it, it's a tough thing to understand). But I assure you a beast is best tamed with reward and care, not whips, nor domestication and neglect.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #9  
    Forum Junior
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    267
    I don't know what you are talking about. The whips and chains and sharp pointed sticks are all in the hands of the psychopath.
    And he uses them too and uses them often. There's nothing you or anyone can do that's going to hurt him.
    and there is nothing you or anyone can do that is going to change him either.

    you need to focus on yourself and changing your own behavior and expectations.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  11. #10  
    Forum Masters Degree LuciDreaming's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Cambridgeshire
    Posts
    656
    What is the point of this thread? 'Your body is a psychopath'??????

    "And we should consider every day lost on which we have not danced at least once. And we should call every truth false which was not accompanied by at least one laugh" Nietzsche.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  12. #11  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    38
    Yes. That is absolutely the point of this thread. Your body is a psychopath.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  13. #12  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    38
    I dunno. Sometimes things are just fun to think about.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  14. #13  
    Forum Cosmic Wizard
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    2,408
    So is Granpa Jonesing?
    babe likes this.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  15. #14  
    Forum Junior
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    267
    our bodies could be and should be vehicles housing us and protecting us and even running errands for us but mother nature doesn't care how things should be. Mother Nature only cares about what passes on the genes best to the next generation. If turning your body into a psychopathic killing machine means that you work a little bit harder and pass your genes on just a fraction of a percent better then that is what she's going to do
    Last edited by granpa; April 3rd, 2014 at 12:57 PM.
    scheherazade likes this.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  16. #15  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Resident of Big Island of Hawai'i since 2003, and in Bayside, Ca. since 1981, Humboldt since 1977
    Posts
    12,976
    Damn and I produced two children.....and they are normal.....then again....I am MOTHER NATURE.

    Haven't you heard the old term?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLrTPrp-fW8
    dan hunter likes this.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  17. #16  
    Forum Radioactive Isotope cosmictraveler's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Key West, Florida, Earth
    Posts
    4,788
    Ultimately, we're talking about taming the beast that has an irrefutable need to survive somehow, while seeing a foreign advanced being as a threat (in this case, the consciousness the beast holds - because, let's face it, it's a tough thing to understand). But I assure you a beast is best tamed with reward and care, not whips, nor domestication and neglect.


    By educating yourself as best you can and by always treating yourself kindly as well as those around you, you will find there's no need to "tame the beast".Controlling ones emotions is part of learning how to get along in this world and the sooner you accomplish that you'll be a happier person.
    scheherazade and babe like this.
    When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace.
    Jimi Hendrix
    Reply With Quote  
     

  18. #17  
    Moderator Moderator Cogito Ergo Sum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Belgium
    Posts
    2,516
    Quote Originally Posted by LuciDreaming View Post
    What is the point of this thread? 'Your body is a psychopath'??????

    Uncertain. I have already reported this thread because it resembles spam and because it is placed on another forum, word for word:
    Cravings - Emotional health, personality, intelligence, anxieties, self esteem... - City-Data Forum
    LuciDreaming likes this.
    "The only safe rule is to dispute only with those of your acquaintance of whom you know that they possess sufficient intelligence and self-respect not to advance absurdities; to appeal to reason and not to authority, and to listen to reason and yield to it; and, finally, to be willing to accept reason even from an opponent, and to be just enough to bear being proved to be in the wrong."

    ~ Arthur Schopenhauer, The Art of Being Right: 38 Ways to Win an Argument (1831), Stratagem XXXVIII.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  19. #18  
    Forum Masters Degree LuciDreaming's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Cambridgeshire
    Posts
    656
    Quote Originally Posted by Cogito Ergo Sum View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by LuciDreaming View Post
    What is the point of this thread? 'Your body is a psychopath'??????

    Uncertain. I have already reported this thread because it resembles spam and because it is placed on another forum, word for word:
    Cravings - Emotional health, personality, intelligence, anxieties, self esteem... - City-Data Forum
    Excellent - its not psychology either....
    "And we should consider every day lost on which we have not danced at least once. And we should call every truth false which was not accompanied by at least one laugh" Nietzsche.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  20. #19  
    Forum Professor jrmonroe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    1,444
    To begin with, we require some substances to support life, and no one will say that we are "addicted" to air or water or food or sleep.

    Other than essentials for life, addictions typically produce positive feedback — the more one has, the more one wants. That's why greed is considered "wrong". The alcoholic cannot have one drink, must but have another and another and another. Alcoholics have told me that they can't simply have one drink, and I knew an alcoholic who drank himself into oblivion many times and finally drank himself to death.

    Desires involve negative feedback; desires typically can be satiated. I wanted to go for a walk, so I went for a walk, and now I'm satisfied.

    I may want to go for a walk, but cannot. Although I'm not satisfied, I don't feen for it. If I do feen for a walk, then maybe I should look at why it controls me so, and whether walking is addictive or not for me. It's a matter of something considered as pathological. (For example, are young people addicted to being connected? People from an older generation might say yes, people from the younger generation might say no.) Wanting to go for a walk once a year may be as pathological as wanting to go for a walk once an hour. Once or twice a day seems "normal" (that is, non-pathological) in my culture. However, if I do completely sedentary work, maybe "normal" actually is getting up about once an hour and walking around the building outside in the fresh air or just walking around inside the office to "stretch my legs".
    scheherazade likes this.
    Grief is the price we pay for love. (CM Parkes) Our postillion has been struck by lightning. (Unknown) War is always the choice of the chosen who will not have to fight. (Bono) The years tell much what the days never knew. (RW Emerson) Reality is not always probable, or likely. (JL Borges)
    Reply With Quote  
     

  21. #20  
    Genius Duck Moderator Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    11,422
    Quote Originally Posted by LuciDreaming View Post
    Your body is a psychopath??????
    Mine is.
    But it gets outvoted by at least 5 of the voices in my head.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
    Reply With Quote  
     

  22. #21  
    Forum Ph.D.
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    940
    Quote Originally Posted by granpa View Post
    You are drawn toward your desires but you are driven toward your cravings.
    One pushes and the other pulls.
    sounds like 2 pulls to me. but it does not matter since the whole OP makes no sense.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  23. #22  
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    5
    At least you're democratic about it. (giggle)
    Quote Originally Posted by Dywyddyr View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by LuciDreaming View Post
    Your body is a psychopath??????
    Mine is.
    But it gets outvoted by at least 5 of the voices in my head.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  24. #23  
    Forum Cosmic Wizard
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    2,408
    Quote Originally Posted by babe View Post
    Damn and I produced two children.....and they are normal.....then again....I am MOTHER NATURE.

    Haven't you heard the old term?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLrTPrp-fW8
    Lonely feeling deep inside
    Find a corner where I can hide
    Silent footsteps crowding me
    Sudden darkness but I can see

    No sugar tonight in my coffee
    No sugar tonight in my tea
    No sugar to stand beside me
    No sugar to run with me

    Datn-doo-dow-dow
    Datn-doo-dow
    Datn-doo-dow-dow
    Datn-doo-dow

    In the silence of her mind
    Quiet movements where I can find
    Grabbing for me with her eyes
    Now Im falling from her skies

    No sugar tonight in my coffee
    No sugar tonight in my tea
    No sugar to stand beside me
    No sugar to run with me

    Datn-doo-dow-dow
    Datn-doo-dow
    Datn-doo-dow-dow
    Datn-doo-dow

    Jocko says, "Yes" and I believe him
    When we talk about the things I say
    She hasnt got the faith or the guts to leave him
    When theyre standing in each others way

    Youre tripping back now to places youve been to
    You wonder what youre gonna find
    You know youve been wrong but it wont be long
    Before you leave em all far behind

    Cause its the new Mother Nature taking over
    Its the new Splendid lady come to call
    Its the new Mother Nature taking over
    Shes gettin us all, shes gettin us all

    Jocko said, "No" when I came back last time
    Its looking like I lost a friend
    No use callin cause the sky is fallin
    And Im getting pretty near the end

    A smoke-filled room in a corner basement
    The situation must be right
    A bag of goodies and a bottle of wine
    Were gonna get it on right tonight

    Cause its the new Mother Nature taking over
    Its the new Splendid Lady come to call
    Its the new Mother Nature taking over
    Shes gettin us all, shes getting us all

    Jocko says, "Yes" and I believe him
    When we talk about the things I say
    She hasnt got the faith or the guts to leave him
    When theyre standing in each others way

    Youre tripping back now to places youve been to
    You wonder what youre gonna find
    You know youve been wrong and it wont be long
    Before you leave em all far behind

    Cause its the new Mother Nature taking over
    Its the new Splendid lady come to call
    Its the new Mother Nature taking over
    Shes gettin us all, shes gettin us all

    Datn-doo-dow-dow
    Datn-doo-dow
    Datn-doo-dow-dow
    Datn-doo-dow

    Datn-doo-dow-dow
    Datn-doo-dow
    Datn-doo-dow-dow
    Datn-doo-dow

    ~Guess Who

    Wikipedia
    According to Randy Bachman, the inspiration for the song arose after an incident when he was visiting California. He was walking down the street with a stack of records under his arm, when he saw three "tough-looking biker guys" approaching. He felt threatened and was looking for a way to cross the street onto the other sidewalk when a car pulled up to the men. A woman got out of the car, shouting at one of them, asking where he'd been all day, that he had left her alone with the kids. The man suddenly was alone and his buddies walked away. Chastened, he got in the car as the woman told him before pulling away: "And one more thing, you're getting no sugar tonight". The words stuck in Bachman's memory.[1]
    Bachman then wrote a short song in the key of F# called "No Sugar Tonight". When he presented the song to Burton Cummings and the record company, he was told that the song was too short. Bachman and Cummings expanded the song by adding to it a song Cummings had written that was also in the key of F#, "New Mother Nature". The song was originally written without the "in my coffee" and "in my tea" wording. The band was ordered to alter the lyrics to make the sexual connotation less obvious.
    Last edited by dan hunter; April 3rd, 2014 at 05:51 PM.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  25. #24  
    Northern Horse Whisperer Moderator scheherazade's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Yukon, Canada
    Posts
    4,066
    Quote Originally Posted by Chucknorium View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by granpa View Post
    You are drawn toward your desires but you are driven toward your cravings.
    One pushes and the other pulls.
    sounds like 2 pulls to me. but it does not matter since the whole OP makes no sense.
    It's just a matter of the words utilized.

    To be drawn toward something is a pull.
    To be driven is like herding horses or cattle, the pressure is from behind.

    The poster has elected to externalize 'desire' while using 'cravings' as coming from within. Depending on the words and the context, they can certainly both be seen as 'pulls' or coming from within.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  26. #25  
    Forum Junior
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    267
    so if i entice you with an offer of money to do something that is the same as if I goad you with a sharp stick till you do it

    they seem completely different to me
    Reply With Quote  
     

  27. #26  
    Genius Duck Moderator Dywyddyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Scunthorpe, UK
    Posts
    11,422
    Quote Originally Posted by granpa View Post
    so if i entice you with an offer of money to do something that is the same as if I goad you with a sharp stick till you do it
    they seem completely different to me
    Failed analogy.
    YOU have declared that "desire" and "craving" are push and pull: you haven't shown it.

    No one claims that money and a sharp stick are the same, they're just pointing out, entirely reasonably, that your differentiation between desire and craving doesn't match anyone else's perception.
    "[Dywyddyr] makes a grumpy bastard like me seem like a happy go lucky scamp" - PhDemon
    Reply With Quote  
     

  28. #27  
    Northern Horse Whisperer Moderator scheherazade's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Yukon, Canada
    Posts
    4,066
    Quote Originally Posted by granpa View Post
    so if i entice you with an offer of money to do something that is the same as if I goad you with a sharp stick till you do it

    they seem completely different to me
    You have used different words and in this case, both money and a sharp stick are externals. Entice and goad are also both external forces. Just the way I see it.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  29. #28  
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    14,168
    The premise that you and your body are different things is faulty. More precisely it is completely wrong. Therefore all arguments stemming from that faulty premise cannot be justified without fully independent evidence. None has been provided. Ergo, this is all crap.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  30. #29  
    Forum Ph.D.
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    940
    You HAVE a body. You HAVE an ego.
    You are not your body.
    You are not your ego.

    Your ego is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must rule over it.
    crouching ego hidden body. the new movie.
    John Galt and LuciDreaming like this.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  31. #30  
    Theatre Whore babe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Resident of Big Island of Hawai'i since 2003, and in Bayside, Ca. since 1981, Humboldt since 1977
    Posts
    12,976
    Quote Originally Posted by Chucknorium View Post
    You HAVE a body. You HAVE an ego.
    You are not your body.
    You are not your ego.

    Your ego is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must rule over it.
    crouching ego hidden body. the new movie.
    Starring Lucy Liu
    Reply With Quote  
     

Similar Threads

  1. Food cravings
    By Pong in forum Health & Medicine
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: December 31st, 2009, 01:27 AM
Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •