Notices
Results 1 to 16 of 16

Thread: "image thinking"

  1. #1 "image thinking" 
    Forum Professor Pendragon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Nederland
    Posts
    1,085
    Have you ever had like when you read a text, you suddenly 'see' a picture or diagram and then you understand what the text is about? Cos I sometimes have this, and It's a really helpfull way to understand complex theories. Maybe I learned myself the trick when I was young, and now it goes unconscious. Does anyone recognise this?


    Reply With Quote  
     

  2.  
     

  3. #2  
    Forum Ph.D.
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Dublin, Ireland
    Posts
    945
    i like the thought of images and thought!, i belive if you imagine what your reading it dose help.. like corrdinate geomatry, to see the lines help'#s alot!!!

    i hear it work's the other way too. i
    if you visualize youself doing something...
    E.g.. catching a ball...

    then you be able to do it better...

    intersting theroy's..


    Stumble on through life.
    Feel free to correct any false information, which unknown to me, may be included in my posts. (also - let this be a disclaimer)
    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #3 Re: "image thinking" 
    Forum Isotope (In)Sanity's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Mesa AZ
    Posts
    2,697
    Quote Originally Posted by Pendragon
    Have you ever had like when you read a text, you suddenly 'see' a picture or diagram and then you understand what the text is about? Cos I sometimes have this, and It's a really helpfull way to understand complex theories. Maybe I learned myself the trick when I was young, and now it goes unconscious. Does anyone recognise this?
    I can visualize anything, rotate it, add to it. It's like having a CAD system in my head. I often solve problems by such visualization, in some cases not actually having to see an image. It's almost like a background process that renders everything and just answers the question.

    The mind is a fascinating thing.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #4  
    Forum Professor Pendragon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Nederland
    Posts
    1,085
    Quote Originally Posted by goodgod3rd
    i hear it work's the other way too. i
    if you visualize youself doing something...
    E.g.. catching a ball...
    Yea I heard something about that on a tv program. They gave one group of athletes physical exercise only, and another group had to imagine the complex movements as well. After a lot of time the 'mental practise' seemed to help. Maybe you should try it out for yourself :wink:

    Quote Originally Posted by (In)Sanity
    I can visualize anything, rotate it, add to it. It's like having a CAD system in my head.
    I envy you :wink: I do have a strong imagination, but I can't really control it. For example, my little brother draws pretty good. He says he just draws the picture he imagines in his mind. I can't do that. Yesterday I was reading through a text on economical history and once in a while an image or diagram popped up, but I can't make it happen whenever I want to. The difficult thing is when I understand something in the form of an image, and I want to explain it to someone else.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #5  
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    The middle padding on your panties
    Posts
    122
    Goodgod3:
    i like the thought of images and thought!, i belive if you imagine what your reading it dose help.. like corrdinate geomatry, to see the lines help'#s alot!!!

    i hear it work's the other way too. i
    if you visualize youself doing something...
    E.g.. catching a ball...

    then you be able to do it better...

    intersting theroy's..
    Like yah!

    If I visualize me strangling the illiterate tumor in your body that's currenlty slaughtering the English language - maybe I'll do it better!
    Like, yah!
    And lol and ha ha!

    You're so bloody female.



    Pendragon:
    Does anyone recognise this?
    A social form of autism.
    They think in pictures.

    But theirs are far more vivid and involved, where ours is, well, weak.

    We all think in pictures as well- try explaining to another what a spiral is without using your fingers to illustrate what your mind is picturing; the main difference between how we think and how they (autistics) do is the fog clouding our images.

    I blame it on the social- civility is mental sewage
    Autistics are not social.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #6  
    Forum Professor Pendragon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Nederland
    Posts
    1,085
    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxas
    We all think in pictures as well- try explaining to another what a spiral is without using your fingers to illustrate what your mind is picturing; the main difference between how we think and how they (autistics) do is the fog clouding our images.
    True, and actually it's a funny thing us humans invented a concept (like the spiral) which can hardly be caught in words. :wink:

    maybe we should just stop thinking words are the only means to carry a message: imagine a book consisting entirely of maps, pictures and diagrams, it could be so effective.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #7  
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    The middle padding on your panties
    Posts
    122
    Pendragon:
    True, and actually it's a funny thing us humans invented a concept (like the spiral) which can hardly be caught in words
    Probably because spirals were invented for clocks and not dictionaries

    maybe we should just stop thinking words are the only means to carry a message: imagine a book consisting entirely of maps, pictures and diagrams, it could be so effective.
    I've written extensively on this, my boy/girl/thing.

    Consider Lagado.
    It was a city that Gulliver traveled to in Swift's world. It was filled with scientists, or projectors, who thought that words were only names for things.
    And since language was so conducive to bickering, they decided to do away with words altogether since they're only measly labels for things and not the things in themselves.

    So imagine all of them, finally freed from the retarding constraints of language and pointing to things instead. They'd have to carry around everything they'd like to communicate to another-so, imagine these packrats lugging their bundles around, sitting down to a conversation about agriculture and pointing to the fruit and ploughs, the milk pails and occasional ox they carry around with them between lectures just to 'talk' about farming.

    And imagine one of them at a bar trying to pick a girl up by pointing to a drying condom.
    Insanities!

    There is much more to words than the letters we assemble from the 26 (in English here)- each word is padded with the nuance, reactive memories and feelings- in other words, experience and meaning- we attribute to each when we process them.
    'Penis' meant nothing to me in my girl hood, but now………cock is GOD.
    *grin*

    Too, consider watching a documentary on a lost city named Palenque- would you honestly learn as much from watching it with the sound off?
    No words, no text, just pictures?.


    I may have bored you about now, so I'll cut it short with an amusement:
    Each word is a world of meaning.
    And look how simply adding one letter can illustrate it perfectly: L
    Word, world.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #8  
    Forum Professor Pendragon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Nederland
    Posts
    1,085
    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxas
    I've written extensively on this, my boy/girl/thing.
    boy here :wink: I gotto read that Gulliver book!

    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxas
    There is much more to words than the letters we assemble from the 26 (in English here)- each word is padded with the nuance, reactive memories and feelings- in other words, experience and meaning- we attribute to each when we process them.
    True, so actually we never know wheter we understand eachother or not. If I say to you "Equality is good", you may agree with it or not, but I'll never be sure whether you really understood it. Equality can mean being treated equally in equal circumstances (article #1 of the dutch constitution), but it can also mean complete 'communist' sameness. I think Wittgenstein wrote something about this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxas
    Too, consider watching a documentary on a lost city named Palenque- would you honestly learn as much from watching it with the sound off?
    No words, no text, just pictures?.
    Let me turn that around, imagine a book containing all information of a standard world-atlas written out in text. no images or maps included. You'd need a whole room to contain the paper
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #9  
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    The middle padding on your panties
    Posts
    122
    I think Wittgenstein wrote something about this.
    Sure did, using the word 'evidence' I believe. In lay conversation its as nothing but in a courtroom a man's life hangs on that word.

    I use the word 'bark', that on a tree and that from a dog are two different things other than one being a noun and the other a verb.
    Context gives the word meaning, and word that context its meaning so that either one on their own is a meaningless swamp.

    What's the poin of calling Terri Chiavo a famous bedsore if she can't process the label?
    She cannot process what you are saying (no context) and so the word makes no sense but to you.

    This got me giddy-
    True, so actually we never know wheter we understand eachother or not. If I say to you "Equality is good", you may agree with it or not, but I'll never be sure whether you really understood it. Equality can mean being treated equally in equal circumstances (article #1 of the dutch constitution), but it can also mean complete 'communist' sameness
    EXACTLY!!
    We only bide our time with illusions, and there is no peace quite like illusion. Read Card?-

    "She had always thought that if only people could communicate mind-to-mind, eliminating the ambiguities of language, then understanding would be perfect and there'd be no more needless conflicts. Instead she had discovered that rather than magnifying differences between people, language might just as easily soften them, minimize them, smooth things over so that people could get along even though they really didn't understand each other. The illusion of comprehension allowed people to think they were more alike than they really were. Maybe language was better"- Xenocide

    *No one* experiences the same thing the same way.
    And Everyone’s thoughts are forged in experience.
    Which means that *no one* ever thinks the same way.

    If we all could communicate telekinetically, there’d always be that frustration of knowing second by second that the person in front of you does not see things the way you do. Externally, you'd behave alike or mimic each other but always you'd know its illusion.

    Your thinking is clearly socialist. His bleeds for democracy.
    Yet the both of you agree on the term 'equality'

    And there'd be no peace and no progress as none would be getting along.
    Anarchy and hail Satan!

    Let me turn that around, imagine a book containing all information of a standard world-atlas written out in text. no images or maps included. You'd need a whole room to contain the paper
    Very true.

    Now imagine a whole altlas with nothing but arrows and squiggles pointing you in directions.

    And which gets you harder? Cheap porn or grossly written Erotica?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  11. #10  
    Forum Professor Pendragon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Nederland
    Posts
    1,085
    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxas
    The illusion of comprehension allowed people to think they were more alike than they really were.- Xenocide
    Good point, never thought about it in that way. So I guess misunderstanding can indeed be good for keeping peace :wink:

    Maybe that's one of the reasons there's so much ideological fighting and bickering in the world nowadays: we allways thought we could get along pretty good, until the internet and other mass media showed that we (for example the americans and europeans) actually differ a lot from eachother.

    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxas
    Now imagine a whole atlas with nothing but arrows and squiggles pointing you in directions.
    True, without words you'd have a hard time making an atlas, but I think it's possible. For example, I've seen a few so called mental maps (the 'picture' someone has formed of an area, drawn out in a map) made by children from Ethiopia or Sudan or so. They hadn't learned writing yet, but could express themselves quite well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxas
    And which gets you harder? Cheap porn or grossly written Erotica?
    Eh yea with my pervert brain I'd go for the written erotic's :P
    Reply With Quote  
     

  12. #11  
    Forum Senior
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    391
    Pendragon,


    So I guess misunderstanding can indeed be good for keeping peace
    Misunderstandings are the key to understanding.
    When we communicate, we do it on the assumption that the other party understands us (exactly the way we meant it), and that we understand the other party (exactly the way they meant it).

    It is only after a misunderstanding has been discovered, that we become aware of the assumption of mutual understanding.

    Only after this, attempts can be made to clarify the matter in question.
    But this is where people's values and preferences come in -- what they think about communication in general and what they think about other people.
    While some are eager to clear up a misunderstanding and be cooperative, some others are eager to call eveyone who doesn't understand them a moron.


    Maybe that's one of the reasons there's so much ideological fighting and bickering in the world nowadays: we allways thought we could get along pretty good, until the internet and other mass media showed that we (for example the americans and europeans) actually differ a lot from eachother.
    I don't think so.
    I think we have always been very much aware of our differences, and proud of them, making a point of them.

    What is so capitally wrong is to think that fundamentally different people can get along well. They can't. They have opposing interests, and thus they can never truly get along.


    Now imagine a whole atlas with nothing but arrows and squiggles pointing you in directions.
    True, without words you'd have a hard time making an atlas, but I think it's possible. For example, I've seen a few so called mental maps (the 'picture' someone has formed of an area, drawn out in a map) made by children from Ethiopia or Sudan or so. They hadn't learned writing yet, but could express themselves quite well.
    Look into an artist's sketchbook. Not a word, but everything is clear to him.


    * * *


    Abraxas,



    "She had always thought that if only people could communicate mind-to-mind, eliminating the ambiguities of language, then understanding would be perfect and there'd be no more needless conflicts. Instead she had discovered that rather than magnifying differences between people, language might just as easily soften them, minimize them, smooth things over so that people could get along even though they really didn't understand each other. The illusion of comprehension allowed people to think they were more alike than they really were. Maybe language was better"- Xenocide
    People have conflicting interests, hence conflicts.
    Language can be a way to gloss over those conflicting interests. I wouldn't blame language for conflicts at all.


    *No one* experiences the same thing the same way.
    And Everyone’s thoughts are forged in experience.
    Which means that *no one* ever thinks the same way.
    And what is the corollary to this?

    What does the idea that "everything is subjective" amount to?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  13. #12 Re: "image thinking" 
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Poland
    Posts
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by Pendragon
    Have you ever had like when you read a text, you suddenly 'see' a picture or diagram and then you understand what the text is about? Cos I sometimes have this, and It's a really helpfull way to understand complex theories. Maybe I learned myself the trick when I was young, and now it goes unconscious. Does anyone recognise this?


    Not unconcious but rather subconciously, isn't it
    Reply With Quote  
     

  14. #13  
    Forum Freshman
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Poland
    Posts
    38
    [quote="Abraxas"]Goodgod3:

    We all think in pictures as well- try explaining to another what a spiral is without using your fingers to illustrate what your mind is picturing; the main difference between how we think and how they (autistics) do is the fog clouding our images.

    I blame it on the social- civility is mental sewage
    Autistics are not social.
    I'll try to explain the spiral.
    It is a geometrical figure of a line or a part of lne which stretches towards one dimension and can be described as a set of more than one circles connected to each other and getting smaller until the last circle ends in a finishing point.

    Not very precise an explanation but it does not take much to explain the spiral.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  15. #14 Re: "image thinking" 
    Forum Junior DivideByZero's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    260
    Quote Originally Posted by Pendragon
    Have you ever had like when you read a text, you suddenly 'see' a picture or diagram and then you understand what the text is about? Cos I sometimes have this, and It's a really helpfull way to understand complex theories. Maybe I learned myself the trick when I was young, and now it goes unconscious. Does anyone recognise this?
    I'm sorry, I couldn't understand you.. maybe a diagram would help :wink:
    Reply With Quote  
     

  16. #15 help needed 
    Forum Sophomore
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    111
    what is the link between thought and image?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  17. #16  
    The Doctor Quantime's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    4,546
    I do it all the time. Especially when learning about physics, imaging all those atoms flying about and bending spacetime :-D.
    "If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe". - Carl Sagan
    Reply With Quote  
     

Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •