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Thread: Moon Rotation

  1. #1 Moon Rotation 
    Forum Freshman shiva108's Avatar
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    Its not a magic or coincidence that the Moon rotates on its axis at the perfect speed to always show one of its faces to the Earth.

    In fact it does not rotate at all!
    with two bodies close to each other, the larger will make the small one stop from spinning.

    In the other topic thread "Moon" by jackson33, quoted the following:

    "it is my understanding the moon has no axis movement or rotation and as if held in position by an invisible stick from earth, shows the same face"

    This invisible stick is called the gravitation hold. The Moon remains fixed on it's axis, the other end of the arm rotates about in the inner earth.
    This is only possibly due to the fact that the earth has a solid core surrounded by molten megma. As the outer earth shell rotates in 24hrs, the center core only rotates once with the moon in ~27.3 days. Since the earths core is the pivot for the moons rotating arm, the rotational difference in earths outer shell and the center core creates enormous friction heat. Also being solid iron, the slowly rotating inner core surrounded by fast rotating molten outer shell creates dynamo effect, hence the magnetic field around the earth.

    This explains the exact syncronous relationship between moons orbit and its apparent rotation on axis to be of same period and hence the same face of the moon we see.


    The only variation from the above i could possibly include is that of the earths outer and inner core rotating together in 24hrs, but the inner core slipping by one rotation due to one moon's orbit in ~27.3 days, this slip speed would still generate frictional heat and magnetic field. And as for the magnetic field changing direction periodically, indicates the solid iron core floating. It would take a external force to make it flip over, like a periodical traveling comet which we don't know yet about.

    Science has proved we have gravity, magnetic field and solid inner core floating in liquid megma.

    My above theory just needs scientific and mathematic support to prove this findings. Anyone out there willing to help me with this please


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  3. #2 Re: Moon Rotation 
    Universal Mind John Galt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiva108
    Its not a magic or coincidence that the Moon rotates on its axis at the perfect speed to always show one of its faces to the Earth.
    Correct. It is not magic and it is not coincidence. It is the consequence of tidal interaction between the two bodies and it is very well understood.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tidal_locking
    In fact it does not rotate at all!
    You are mistaken. It does rotate, once per month.
    This is only possibly due to the fact that the earth has a solid core surrounded by molten megma. As the outer earth shell rotates in 24hrs, the center core only rotates once with the moon in ~27.3 days.
    The inner core is surrounded by molten nickel iron - not quite magma, but it is molten. Beyond this is the solid mantle.
    We know, from seismic studies, how fast the various parts of the Earth's interior rotate. They do not do behave as you have described.
    My above theory just needs scientific and mathematic support to prove this findings. Anyone out there willing to help me with this please
    Yes I am willing and I hope I have done so. Your hypothesis is wrong. I applaud your imagination in developing and proposing it, but it is incorrect. Like many good ideas it has been invalidated by inconvenient facts.


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  4. #3  
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    The earth has 5 moons, the other 4 have very strange rotations/orbits so I dont think there is only one kind of rotation as you seem to be suggesting.
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  5. #4  
    Forum Freshman shiva108's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robbie
    The earth has 5 moons, the other 4 have very strange rotations/orbits so I dont think there is only one kind of rotation as you seem to be suggesting.
    Other moons are not significant in size, here there is definately one type of rotation.

    When I say inner core I mean the centre nickle/iron core, which is solid floating in molten magma, right?
    shiva108
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  6. #5  
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    [quote="shiva108"]
    Quote Originally Posted by Robbie
    When I say inner core I mean the centre nickle/iron core, which is solid floating in molten magma, right?
    Wrong. As I noted above the solid core lies within a liquid outer core which is composed of nickel iron - that is not magma.

    Robbie, please provide citations for your four extra moons.
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  7. #6  
    Forum Freshman shiva108's Avatar
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    Still the solid core is floating! don't care if magma, liquid iron/nickel or mixer.


    So my thinking is still valid yes
    shiva108
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  8. #7  
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    Point 1: No, the core is not floating. Floating requires displacement of a mass of liquid equal to the mass of the floating object. that is patently not the case here.
    Point 2: If you don't care whether or not its called magma, don't insist on calling it that.
    Point 3: Your idea is not valid. Please re-read my first post. We know the rotational speeds of the inner and outer cores and of the mantle. Practically speaking they are rotating along with each other.
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  9. #8  
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    Wrong. As I noted above the solid core lies within a liquid outer core which is composed of nickel iron - that is not magma.

    Robbie, please provide citations for your four extra moons.
    Reading from above, solid core lies within liquid, now that's floating isn't it.
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  10. #9  
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiva108
    Wrong. As I noted above the solid core lies within a liquid outer core which is composed of nickel iron - that is not magma.

    Robbie, please provide citations for your four extra moons.
    Reading from above, solid core lies within liquid, now that's floating isn't it.
    Strictly speaking, the core has 'sunk' as far as it can. A sunken object is most definitely not floating....

    Cheers
    "... the polhode rolls without slipping on the herpolhode lying in the invariable plane."
    ~Footnote in Goldstein's Mechanics, 3rd ed. p. 202
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  11. #10  
    Forum Freshman shiva108's Avatar
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    Thanks, All this proving very positive so far..

    The solid core, surrounded by liquid nick/iron.. therefore the soild core can rotate at different speed than the other layers of the inner earht layers. The rotation of the core is locked and servers as a pivot for the moons orbit.

    What you think guys
    shiva108
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  12. #11  
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    Actually, the accepted answer to this riddle is that the Moon's rotational speed was set when it was still all magma. It's called "tidally locked" rotation. Pluto and Charon are in a similar state.

    The reason the Earth is able to rotate faster is because it's larger, so the tidal effect was less.
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  13. #12  
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiva108
    Reading from above, solid core lies within liquid, now that's floating isn't it.
    No. It isn't. The molten outer core lies above the solid inner core. There is no way in which this can be described as floating - unless you consider that the oceanic crust around the Azores is floating in the Atlantic!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiva108
    The solid core, surrounded by liquid nick/iron.. therefore the soild core can rotate at different speed than the other layers of the inner earht layers. The rotation of the core is locked and servers as a pivot for the moons orbit.

    What you think guys
    I think you may be terminally thick? For the third time, we know the rotational speed of the core and the other layers within the Earth. They are practically identical. Your idea is wrong. Imaginative. Nice speculation, but wrong. How many times will I have to tell you this. A simple Google search will reveal I am not making this up.

    Accept it. The only way to have good, effective ideas in science is to have lots of them. Most of them will be wrong. The trick is to recognise when that is the case, accept it, and move on to the next one. Are you ready to move on?
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  14. #13 floating... 
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    I think floating implies boyancy, and boyancy means that there is pressure from one ore more directions keeping something (a boat) from going somewhere else (the bottom of the ocean). I would argue that the earth's crust is pressure against the core, which behaves like a ship in that it isn't stationary under this pressure, but it does keep it from 'going somwhere else' (ejecting into space).

    And that's why dogs hate cats.
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  15. #14 Re: floating... 
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    Quote Originally Posted by jharr
    I think floating implies boyancy, and boyancy means that there is pressure from one ore more directions keeping something (a boat) from going somewhere else (the bottom of the ocean). I would argue that the earth's crust is pressure against the core, which behaves like a ship in that it isn't stationary under this pressure, but it does keep it from 'going somwhere else' (ejecting into space).

    And that's why dogs hate cats.
    I would suggest there is no boyancy. The fact that there is liquid above the solidified core would suggest that the core is "UNDER" the liquid (since the liquid is "ABOVE" the core).

    This is like saying the Submarine Kursk is floating in the north Sea because it is under all the water. Obviously this is not the case.

    What has happened with the solidified portion of the core is either 1: it has sunk as far as it can (the centre of the earth, everywhere from there is "up")

    or 2: The huge pressure on the liquified rock has compressed it so much it has turned solid. If this were so the rock would progressivley become more and more solid the further toward the middle you went. So it'd be highly pressurized liquid, pressurized so much it became viscous, then gooey, then solid the further you went down, perhaps something like Jupiter and it's liquid core.

    I can get my head around both of those ideas to make them work, but I tend to think number 1 is more likley.

    The core could not eject into space due to Gravity, and the fact there is the issue of it having free passage to the surface.

    I would accept the term that humans (cars, trucks, buildings etc) "float" on the rocks and dirt on the surface of earth.
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  16. #15  
    Forum Freshman shiva108's Avatar
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    Ophiolite, Thick people have something called brains, in your case it must be empty, since you are learning science by searching google here is what simple search in google reveals:

    Reference: http://www.solarviews.com/eng/earthint.htm

    "Inner core: 1.7% of the Earth's mass; depth of 5,150-6,370 kilometers (3,219 - 3,981 miles)
    The inner core is solid and unattached to the mantle, suspended in the molten outer core. It is believed to have solidified as a result of pressure-freezing which occurs to most liquids when temperature decreases or pressure increases."

    So the inner core in suspended and unattached, making it possible to rotate independently.

    Back to the original idea of the moons rotation, this inner core therefore acts as the rotational pivot for the moons orbit.
    shiva108
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  17. #16  
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    The moon is only attached to the earth by gravity, it is otherwise a free-floating body. There is no "Pivot point".

    Of course tidal forces cause odd things to happen. The two bodies are close enough in size to effect each others rotation. This is not a magic or mechanical "Pivot point" but rather a relationship whereby gravity and mass is trying to even itself out. It is still not in fully stabilized relationship shown by the fact that the moon is gaining velocity in it's orbit slowly, and earth's rotation is slowly loosing speed. This change is happening in inches per year, which in the scheme of hundreds of thousands of miles is hardly worth mentioning, if it wern't for millions of years.

    The language you are using makes it sound like there is some collossal machine grinding away inside the earth, pulling around by brute force, the moon's orbit.

    This picture is, of course, absurd.
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  18. #17 Re: Moon Rotation 
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiva108
    Its not a magic or coincidence that the Moon rotates on its axis at the perfect speed to always show one of its faces to the Earth.

    In fact it does not rotate at all!
    with two bodies close to each other, the larger will make the small one stop from spinning.

    In the other topic thread "Moon" by jackson33, quoted the following:

    "it is my understanding the moon has no axis movement or rotation and as if held in position by an invisible stick from earth, shows the same face"

    This invisible stick is called the gravitation hold. The Moon remains fixed on it's axis, the other end of the arm rotates about in the inner earth.
    This is only possibly due to the fact that the earth has a solid core surrounded by molten megma. As the outer earth shell rotates in 24hrs, the center core only rotates once with the moon in ~27.3 days. Since the earths core is the pivot for the moons rotating arm, the rotational difference in earths outer shell and the center core creates enormous friction heat. Also being solid iron, the slowly rotating inner core surrounded by fast rotating molten outer shell creates dynamo effect, hence the magnetic field around the earth.

    This explains the exact syncronous relationship between moons orbit and its apparent rotation on axis to be of same period and hence the same face of the moon we see.


    The only variation from the above i could possibly include is that of the earths outer and inner core rotating together in 24hrs, but the inner core slipping by one rotation due to one moon's orbit in ~27.3 days, this slip speed would still generate frictional heat and magnetic field. And as for the magnetic field changing direction periodically, indicates the solid iron core floating. It would take a external force to make it flip over, like a periodical traveling comet which we don't know yet about.

    Science has proved we have gravity, magnetic field and solid inner core floating in liquid megma.

    My above theory just needs scientific and mathematic support to prove this findings. Anyone out there willing to help me with this please


    dude, the moon is cheese,its a mans face, dude its a coincidence,


    yeah...science rules
    im cool and u suck
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