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| jhagel |
 Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 1:07 am Post subject: Computers and the speed of electricity... |
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New Member
Joined: 18 Nov 2009
Posts: 2
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I'm wondering why computers do not do every single task instantly? I'll start with a more basic computer. The calculator. Why does it take time (the "busy" sign appears and you have to wait a second) for calculators to process a large calculation. Everytime I ask this people just say that it has so much to process that it can't do it instantly, but this isn't a clear reason.
The calculator runs on electricity and processes binary information with it as its only means of processing information so why should you have to wait more than a fraction of a millisecond for virtually anything to compute? Does it have to do with the logic gates? Are there actual physical moving parts in the logic gates? Also, is that the only reason or the main reason why calculations don't happen instantly. It seems the amount of calculation wouldn't be large enough for it to take time since electricity travels near the speed of light.
I have a feeling I'm missing some key points, but if I'm correct that logic gates are the sole cause for this it seems that this is the fundamental reason why computers take time to load anything. Hypothetically, if logic gates processed instantly(I'm assuming they don't) and computers used solid state drives then wouldn't it be possible to, say, press power then instantly boot up?
If I'm missing any reasons why computers take time to process information please explain in detail for me. Thanks a lot. |
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| HarryPotter |
| Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 1:40 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 11 Oct 2008
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For processes to be carried out by a computer everything has to be timed. It is all based on your computers clock speed. For a 1GHz processor, it is computing 1 billion processes a second which is super fast but limits your computer to working below the speed of light. Also the gates themselves do limit the speed, causing somewhat of a drag on the electrons traveling through them. The more gates you have the more of a delay there will be. In fact I don't believe that electrons can travel the speed of light in anything but a perfect vacuum.
That is just a quick overview of some factors limiting the speed of your computer. There is more to it than that but I think you might be able to see why it cannot run at the speed of light.
~HP |
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| Pong |
| Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 2:13 am Post subject: |
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Forum Radioactive Isotope
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
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Another issue is the heat of funnelling energy through a minuscule wafer. Hot chips burn out. The smaller you make them the faster they, but also the more fragile. You can use weak voltages but then you get errors. Modern processors include a thermostat. They'll run fast and heat up in a few seconds, then ease off below a narrow margin of safety.
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A pong by any other name is still a pong. -williampinn |
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| skepticlogician |
| Posted: Wed Dec 23, 2009 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 08 Dec 2009
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I think there's a couple more things about computing that shouldn't be overlooked. Computers were invented to solve problems FASTER than human beings. And problems come in trillions of types, sizes, complexities, etc.
For example, it's not the same to ask "how much is 2+2?" as to ask "What are the top 3 best moves in this chess position?".
So, the first point I'm trying to make is that it's impossible and illogical to think that a computer can (or should) solve all kinds of problems at the same speed (instantly). Computers are not like a humongous Q&A book. They compute and calculate, which means they do not lookup the answer for a particular question, instead, they solve a problem on the fly, by making calculations. Even if they could lookup every possible answer for every possible question, it would take more time, for example, to lookup the answer to question #4 trillion than for question #11.
Secondly, computers are not truly intelligent, they are just monstrous calculator beasts. Unlike humans, they cannot make use of common sense and this compounds on the problem because, due to this fact, computers have to actually take many more steps or make many more calculations than it would take for a human being. For example, let's go back to the chess example. When a human chess player (obviously one with some playing experience) is trying to come up with the best move on a particular position, he or she automatically skips and doesn't even consider moves that are, for example, obviously losing a piece with nothing in return, which drastically reduces the number of posibilities to take into consideration. But for a computer this is a different matter. A computer has to consider every single possible move that is not against the rules of the game. A move cannot be obviously wrong to the "computer's eye" because they do not possess comon sense to distinguish it, thus, they have to make millions of calculations and comparisons to come up with the best move.
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| leohopkins |
| Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:06 am Post subject: electricity |
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Forum Professor
Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 1392
Location: Croydon, England
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Also......
Electrons (however small they maybe) do have mass. Thus they cannot quite reach the speed of light even in a perfect vacuum!! - Only photons can do this (and a handful of other massless particles within the standard model)
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| Goddard |
| Posted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 12:22 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 11 Nov 2009
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| new technologies are being discovered all the time. I am sure a time will come when this is possible, but currently computers operate in cycles, looping through data, and simple commands. |
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| Wild Cobra |
| Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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Forum Ph.D.
Joined: 01 Sep 2009
Posts: 901
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Mr. Potter gets points for his house.
Electrons do not travel the speed of light in semiconductors.
When calculators were first made, they had an unknown (to me) number of gates they had to go through. At the time, gate speeds were rather limited and measured in several nano-seconds for transition times, from 10% to 90% for a 0 to 1 state. Then of course, you had hold, setup times, etc. High speed was maybe 50 MHZ those years back. Modern calculators today still have gate delays and may speeds. Some years back, I remember seeing a new lime of Motorola chips called "Eclipse." ECL in Pico-Seconds. Now we have gate transitions in pico seconds. Still, computers are limited, and we may be at a hard wall to get over. Even is electond can travel in near zero delay gates, 1 GHZ speed has a clack cycle of 1 nano-second. At the speed of light, this is 300 mm. What can faster than 3 GHZ processors do for us when, to be effective, the memory has to be within 2 inched for a one clock cycle wait state response?
Went past the question, but it takes several cycles to do a math problem. Depends on the speed of the circuitry as well. No need to use state of the art circuit designs requiring multiple CMP passes per wafer and a Damascus copper process when older technology works fine at much less cost.
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| schip666 |
| Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 10:02 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 19 Feb 2010
Posts: 61
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Two words: capacitance and resistance...
Every circuit element has a capacitance due to having conductors separated by insulators. It takes time to charge a capacitor: t = RC (where R is resistance, C is capacitance, and t is the time to reach .707 -- remember that magic number from RMS discussions? -- of the supply voltage). One can reduce R, but that requires more power which creates more heat and usually needs larger circuit areas.
The speed of electrical charge, light, etal, affects larger circuits and the wiring between them, but it's not the major limiting factor on gate speed. |
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| Robert Gentle |
| Posted: Mon Jun 21, 2010 3:07 am Post subject: |
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New Member
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 4
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Hi.
Actually speed of the computer depends on the speed of the processor.
All computers use a timing clock, actually a crystal, to drive
them. This clock or crystal has high and low voltage changes, and changes
at an exact frequency. Each time the clock changes, the computer's
processor processes some part of an instruction.
Thanks.
http://www.allsee-tech.com/ |
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